I agree 100% with you on this.

I'm not much of a romantic, never have been. They could do away with Valentine's Day; I wouldn't miss it.

A bit of romance ("on the side") is okay; if believable and low key and enhancing the story, I can tolerate it. The Gothic setting/atmosphere is key for me.

Of course one true plus in this regard is a love interest can also be suspect...

As for outright romance novels? Never read one, likely never will.

I'm with you both on this. I prefer my gothic with a nice dollop of supernatural suspense. I tolerate the romance because gothic novels are, for the most part, the only supernatural stories where the ghostly aspect is presented as anything more than simply an "evil adversary". At least the world of gothic romance is willing to present the possibility that all denizens of the other side aren't ravening beasts out to eat our brains (with much description of the act).

In my desperate search for gothic suspense novels that would go easy on the gore and wouldn't offer squirmy, story slowing sex scenes I have come across a few novels that seemed more focused on romance and they are usually a huge let down.
Of course I'm talking about mass market popular novels here, not classics. Wuthering Heights was NEVER simply a boy meets girl and gets swept off his feet catalogue of their mutual gorgeousness. The romance was used to further the grim history of Cathy and Heathcliffe. The story was not simply an excuse for a meet cute romance.

Same for me. It's the gothic part that's key. Atmosphere, atmosphere, atmosphere! I don't mind a gothic with romance in it, but romance without the gothic -- or at least high suspense -- isn't my cup of tea.

Nor should the romance become too maudlin or the author indulge in pages of angst-ridden inner monologue. This quickly becomes tiresome. One thing second-rate authors often forget is that we, the readers, know that the heroine and her beloved will get together in the end. What's of interest is HOW this will happen, not IF. Too much time spent on the "if" factor is annoying.

One interesting feature of the gothic / romantic suspense novel is often the presence of several possible suitors for the heroine, but you don't know at first who's good and who's bad and which of them she'll end up with. Anything that keeps up the sense of mystery is good.

The locale or setting of a novel is a matter of make-or-break importance for me. I want to vicariously live through the experience and that means it has to take place in an environment I myself would find appealing in some way, even if it's ominous or sinister in atmosphere. Who wouldn't want to go exploring an ancient castle full of hidden passages or an old manor house on the moors?

Additional elements that will keep me coming back to an author: hints of a ghost or a curse on the house or the dynasty that lives there (especially when there is no conclusive evidence, just eerie suggestion); mysteriously draconian servant characters of the Mrs. Danvers type who may or may not mean well for the heroine; grandfather clocks; tea and coffee; the setting being isolated and possibly inaccessible during the harsh winter months; also inexplicable events that cause the heroine to wonder if she's losing her mind (of course we know she isn't but what is happening?) . . .

Clichés? Sure! Formula? Certainly -- but then a chess game is a formula, the pieces always laid out on the board in the same fashion and moved according to expected patterns. Everything depends on who's playing the game and, in the case of gothic novels, who's writing the book.

Oh -- and an attractive, modest and intelligent heroine is of course a must. Mary Stewart and Victoria Holt unfailingly provide appealing heroines (IMO) that don't seem dated even now. They're strong but vulnerable.

Another quality I look for in a gothic: a sense of timelessness, that the story doesn't really feel like the present-day real world even if it does take place in it. Sure, the heroine may step off a 747 jet and take a taxi to her destination, but once she gets there, she might as easily be in the 19th century as the present. I prefer when the author doesn't commit to the story being in too specific a time period, so that it's not too rigidly linked to the present. It's all part of the escape.

Penfeather that is an extraordinary bit of writing! Thanks for such a thoughtful and well written post!

These are thought-provoking posts and my response may not make much sense because I'm "winging it" at work. Here goes!

Hmmm....I guess one thing I've noticed in my own reading is that I seem to differentiate between a "romance" and a "love story." They are two different things to me.

A "romance" is a formula that you find in the "romance" section of the book store. You know what you're going to get. It's a fantasy with a varying number of sex scenes (a lot or a few). There may be different iterations, but that's what it's all about. Usually, the only "adult" aspect is the sex. But the romance is the centerpiece of the book. That's what you buy it for. To me, a "Gothic romance" is basically a romance (as indicated above) with some Gothic atmosphere thrown in.

In contrast, I do like a good love story EMBEDDED in a gothic novel. I'm reading it for the Gothic storyline, but I LOVE it when a love story is thrown in for good measure. It enhances the story for me and satisfies my romantic side which has no patience for formulas. Don't get me wrong...sometimes I'll pick up a romance, but I rarely finish one.

My favorite kind of emotional connection is the Beauty and the Beast kind (saw Phantom in Seattle yesterday and LOVED it), but I'll take anything that is mature and emotional. I appreciate any gothic novel with a human connection be it star-crossed lovers or the love between a parent and a child, yadda yadda.